The Sewing Place

Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision

SkoutSews

Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« on: August 28, 2017, 10:26:12 AM »
I'm starting a new topic for this one as I didn't want to hijack the previous thread.  Although the subject matter might overlap, it's a bit niche and machine-specific.

The new Singer 401g is going well and currently employed in curtain-making, which I hate, and so is very much an 'on-off' project.  However I'm already falling into the 'what I need now is....' trap! What I need now is...a buttonholer to fit the machine.  I've done a fair bit of online research and found that the any of the slant shank buttonholers would do the job. Ismacs has a lot of info http://ismacs.net/singer_sewing_machine_company/more-on-singer-buttonholers.html.  Helen Howes http://www.helenhowes-sewingmachines.co.uk/bigatts.html#buttonholers has two candidates, one a cam-style buttonholer, in a Jetson box, which works off the straight stitch capability.  The other is a singer Professional, stated to be for a Golden Panorama machine, with more cams and utilising the machine zig-zag. I feel the Jetson one is pricey for what it is.  I'm inclined to favour the Professional, but the feed dog cover plate with the buttonholer isn't the correct one for the 401g, which takes part number 161825, a different cover without the screwholes. 

My questions are:  What are people's experiences of the two types of buttonholer?  Which do you prefer for ease of use and end result?  and
Is the feed dog cover essential, given that, on the 401, the throat plate can be raised to avoid the feed dogs? I'm thinking along the lines of raising the throat plate, putting in the plastic plate lift frame thingy (sorry for lack of correct terminology!)? Or would that interfere with the working of the attachment? 

You will see that I am very much in need of some practical advice from some of you knowledgeable people who have actually used the buttonholers.  Until I got my modern Janome I never knew of the existence of buttonhole feet and sewed them all manually, so I've never used one.


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Re: Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2017, 11:15:00 AM »
The ones with cams are simple and easy to use and works by inserting one of the cams and there's very little fuzz with settings. I think stitch length is adjusted with a side lever. The Panoramic and Professional have most cams and with a few extra large cams the other ones doesn't have. Those with cams have keyhole shaped too. There a few variants on these, even for slant shanks. The older black type have cast aluminium cams, the newer ones are plastic; both options are well within acceptable and there's very little problems with them. Mechanically the buttonholer are mostly metal, some have plastic covers and knobs but the internal is metal.

The ones with out cams can be adjusten to any size with in it's min-to-max range. I have the old black Singer version (green box), I think the slant shank version is in the burgundy box (Helen Howes have a picture of one), low shank in a green; but always double check with seller, because mixups are common. There is a bit more screws involved and a bit more test buttonholes, but the gradualy buttonhole size is nice. Once set for the correct size, you are ready to stitch one after the other. These have straight buttonholes only.

I don't think you need the cover plate for the 401g, since as you mention the needle plate can be lifted above the feed dogs. The videos on youtube shows them running with out the additional plate. I would think the slant  shank version were made for this. Models like 301 can't lower the feed dogs, and I guess that's the reason the cover plate is often in the box sets. It's much the same with the straight stitch models. When buttonholers were new to me I had a feeling they behaved better with the cover plate, but it turned out to be all about thread tension, needle size, and presserfoot tension. I have only used them on my 201 and 99, but it's very much the same thing on any machine. The buttonholer and needle clamp do all the work.

Its' hard to recommend one or the others, they work very well and each have their advantages. I have both and are both keeping and using them.

« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 11:32:59 AM by arrow »

Roger

Re: Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2017, 15:35:06 PM »
It probably is worth hunting for the right buttonholer with the right feedcover, here is an article around the different plates;
http://www.thesewbox.com/2008/10/singer-professional-buttonholer.html?m=1

Most often sellers on eBay don't realise there's a machine specific plate under the device.

I have the same darning plate raising mechanism on the 500a as the 401. It surprised my sewing instructor:)... the downside of using it in this context is that it may reduce the level of clearance you have for fabric... having said that the slant shanks amount of foot clearance is very nearly industrial, (which also surprised my instructor).
A bit of a vintage sewing machine nut! Singers: 500a, 401g, 48k Elnas: lotus SP & grasshopper, Bernina 530-2 F+R 504, Pfaff 30, Cresta T-132

Roger

Re: Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2017, 15:42:10 PM »
I have a golden panoramic automatic button holer (which I haven't tested) I also have a template griest, which I run on the pfaff, this does stunning buttonholes and an adjustable singer buttonholer, which also does awesome buttonholes but I'm a sucker for the keyhole buttonholes you get from a template.

Having said that the instruction manual for the 500 describes how to make a really good and pretty fast buttonhole, so I'm guessing that the 401 is similar.
A bit of a vintage sewing machine nut! Singers: 500a, 401g, 48k Elnas: lotus SP & grasshopper, Bernina 530-2 F+R 504, Pfaff 30, Cresta T-132

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Re: Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2017, 15:45:02 PM »
I think the jetson version was made in the US, and not the most common here. The same buttonholer was made in the UK, but didn't have the fancy plastic box. At that price you might as well order from the US, or accept a cardboard box. In perfect condition they are worth the money, a new one would cost around the same, even more (I'm comparing to the only current production YS star buttonholer, it's high shank). With a bit of time and patience they turn up at more affordable prices.

This one is for a slant shank, I have the same in a green box. It's nice, I am on the look for the additional cam set.
A gem is available on ebay, nice condition with lost of cams, but postage makes it a bit expensive.

The professional or Panoramic looks very nice, I guess it's for 60s and 70s models, but as mention with the extra large cams.  You can't go wrong with either of them, but at times you might wish you had more cam sizes to choose from. Loads of cams with this one, and it looks like it has the correct feed cover? It's complete and ideal for the slant shanks.







« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 16:01:13 PM by arrow »

Roger

Re: Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2017, 15:47:39 PM »
I'd love one of the pink slant-o-matic jetsons... I really should save up and import one :)
A bit of a vintage sewing machine nut! Singers: 500a, 401g, 48k Elnas: lotus SP & grasshopper, Bernina 530-2 F+R 504, Pfaff 30, Cresta T-132

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Re: Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2017, 15:52:03 PM »
Roger, with your 500 the buttonholer box itself is almost mandatory ;- )
« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 15:55:03 PM by arrow »

Roger

Re: Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2017, 17:08:14 PM »
Completely! Mad space aged styling from the future!

It's such outrageous but iconic styling!

Arrow, just spotted a Swedish 221k:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/222622927888
« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 17:14:13 PM by Roger »
A bit of a vintage sewing machine nut! Singers: 500a, 401g, 48k Elnas: lotus SP & grasshopper, Bernina 530-2 F+R 504, Pfaff 30, Cresta T-132

SkoutSews

Re: Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2017, 19:27:22 PM »
Arrow and Roger, thank you both for your helpful advice and links. It sounds like the cam-type buttonholer is what I need. It also seems that the feed dog cover specific to the 401 is not easy to find! The Stitchery link was very useful for that, the photos clearly show the difference between the plates and the US Ebay one doesn't look right.  I'll hunker down and wait to see what comes up online. That approach paid off with my search for the machine and perhaps I'll be lucky again.
I agree with Arrow, that Jetson case is just right for the Rocketeer!
Your help has been very useful, thanks.

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Re: Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2017, 19:54:03 PM »
Here are some details on the stitch length cover. IT looks very much like the one in the picture, you could perhaps ask seller for a part number, it's #161825

Roger

Re: Advice please! Singer 401g buttonholer decision
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2017, 20:46:37 PM »
Glad I could help... there was a flurry of these on U.K. eBay recently and I got one for dads day :) I think it was about £15.

These buttonholers are often on, I just kept asking for a pic of the feed plate cover till I found the right one. At least it's a distinctive difference between the variations.

I'll keep an eye on eBay too... :)
A bit of a vintage sewing machine nut! Singers: 500a, 401g, 48k Elnas: lotus SP & grasshopper, Bernina 530-2 F+R 504, Pfaff 30, Cresta T-132