The Sewing Place

Which machine?

Efemera

Which machine?
« on: August 13, 2017, 22:28:58 PM »
Since the 401 disaster (still waiting for a refund) I've been looking for an everyday vintage machine..
What would folks recommend Singer wise?

Roger

Re: Which machine?
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2017, 22:57:50 PM »
Hi,

What do you have in mind to use it for?

The 401 or 404 are probably the best all metal zz capable machines, while the 201 is the straight stitch smoothest, 15, 66, 99 all have excellent reputations too for a beautiful stitch
A bit of a vintage sewing machine nut! Singers: 500a, 401g, 48k Elnas: lotus SP & grasshopper, Bernina 530-2 F+R 504, Pfaff 30, Cresta T-132

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Re: Which machine?
« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2017, 00:10:20 AM »
If it the crack in the case could be mended the 401 disaster might not have been such a disaster after all. They turn up now and then, and you might as well keep looking for one. I think Jessie (b15erk) found a 601 or something like that she took to heart. If I remember correctly it's all metal and close to the 401; class 66 bobbins and not in the touch & sew line. There should be models worth looking for among 500 and 600 numbers, but when you come as far as the 60s you have to take a second look at the internals, more plastic gears and some don't like the fancy bobbin functions of the touch and sew series (even though some of them are all metal and of very similar quality as the 400 series). When searching among Singer models remember than the model numbers are not in line with year of introduction (like the prewar models to a large degree were). We have to take a look at each model individually. The 400 numbers of the 1950s were the last with all metal gears, a few models among 500 and 600 numbers (1960s models) are all metal and gear driven. These are of nicer qualities with these vintage models, especially 50 year on.

Don't disregards Elnas or Berninas either if they happen to turn up, they are nice. I can even recommend the Supermatics as long as you are aware of the rubber pulley factor (needs replacement or a work around). There are lots of worthy brands worth a second look. By the 1950s most European brands seems to have adopted plastic gears. 
« Last Edit: August 14, 2017, 12:26:05 PM by arrow »

Efemera

Re: Which machine?
« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2017, 09:05:41 AM »
The 401 seller didn't give me much option.... I would have negotiated, the machine itself was bashed. She just said pack it up and send it back, buy that time I'd had enough.
I want the machine to stitch card, leather and other stuff, more for arty things than dressmaking.

b15erk

Re: Which machine?
« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2017, 09:41:20 AM »
'Twas me arrow!  It was a 611g that I got, and I love it.  It is a slant shank, with a good array of stitches, and does an excellent satin stitch.  The buttonholes are superb, and made with an attachment.  It also does a lovely chain stitch, but the adaptors sometimes get lost.  There is also a double needle facility - not a twin needle, two separate needles.

Unlike the Touch and Sew, it doesn't need special bobbins.

Jessie

Jessie, who is very happy to be here!!  :),  but who has far too many sewing machines to be healthy, and a fabric stash which is becoming embarrassing.

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Re: Which machine?
« Reply #5 on: August 14, 2017, 12:47:45 PM »
...I want the machine to stitch card, leather and other stuff, more for arty things than dressmaking.

If the machine was damaged it's probably turned out for the best considering. I don't mind a fixup machine at the right price, but it has to be possible to repair or replace the parts.

I came to think of the early Necchis and Pfaff 130s. They are not common, but when they turn up they are worth considering. I have stitched rather thick cardboard on my freearm Elna Supermatic. It's quite sturdy and strong considering the size and weight of the machine. There's a few plastic gears, but they are not in places they take much load. The advantage of some of the vintage models, is they take large needles. I have bought some for purposes like this. It's not as much the machine as the needle that limits stitching in leather, cardboard, plastic lining and odd things. A 401 is a very nice machine, and I can't really recommend putting it through work that's too much for it. At the right price you might consider an industrial. Some 1950s Pfaff models (concrete grey) are all metal, very sturdy with extra strong motor. Those are worth looking for too.  These are well worth the time and money for a service and DIY repairs. The only thing I have against them is the grey color, I've had too much of it the last 18 years.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2017, 12:57:38 PM by arrow »

Efemera

Re: Which machine?
« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2017, 13:10:53 PM »
What do we think of a 320?

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Re: Which machine?
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2017, 13:50:57 PM »
Pfaff 320? Very nice range of models. I think the number 320 signifies a few models, and I think Pfaff calls them "klasse 320", or class 320 machines. They can have more or less stitch patterns and functions, flat bed or freearm version, all grey or with white top.

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Re: Which machine?
« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2017, 14:46:29 PM »
If pick up were possible, this is the sort of machine I would take a chance on. It needs a table or cabinet, a couple of replacement parts, and I know it's a nice model. I also know the reverse button probably needs a lot of oiling from behind, as well as the rest of the machine.

b15erk

Re: Which machine?
« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2017, 15:11:51 PM »
There's a Singer Golden Panoramic for sale on Gumtree: https://www.gumtree.com/p/arts-crafts/ads/1261118239?EDID=FDV6NOY-YBGEPG-BMMP8TO-DNQ58F-9KWBPZ-v1&CELLID=13750038&utm_source=savedsearches&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Daily&utm_content=GpB_month

Seems a bit expensive at first glance - £200, but it has the buttonholer, a lot of other attachments, it's in a table, and the chain stitch adapter appears to be there as well.

Might be worth a second look....

Jessie
Jessie, who is very happy to be here!!  :),  but who has far too many sewing machines to be healthy, and a fabric stash which is becoming embarrassing.

Efemera

Re: Which machine?
« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2017, 16:04:33 PM »
It was a Singer 320 I was looking at.... I've got no room for a table or cabinet, it will have to be kept in a cupboard.

b15erk

Re: Which machine?
« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2017, 16:14:45 PM »
I have a Singer 327k E, and it's a workhorse.  It's the one I use most at work.  Just straight stitch and zig zag, nothing fancy, but it does everything I ask it to.

Jessie
Jessie, who is very happy to be here!!  :),  but who has far too many sewing machines to be healthy, and a fabric stash which is becoming embarrassing.

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Re: Which machine?
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2017, 18:11:50 PM »
Some like the 320 a lot, call it a work horse and have taken it as their favorite machine, the same for the flatbed version 319. There was a girl on the old sewing forum who had timing trouble with her machine, a couple of times the needle hit the bobbin case, or a bead or something, it broke and needed to be reset. Originally they took needle system 206x13, but a lot of them have apparetnly been adjusten for regular 705 needles. The Golden Panoramic looks promising, but I have never had my hands on one.

Roger

Re: Which machine?
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2017, 20:31:08 PM »
Hi!
I would be cautious of slant shank machines for ad-hoc craft purposes, because the needles is at angle (hence the slant shank) because the angle means the needle has to travel through more of the material than a straight shank so needle breaks and penetration issues might be more common according to Helen Howes and to be fair I have had some issues with more layered projects, but I don't push the 500 too hard.

A 15k with a zz attachment might not be a bad bet.

319/320ks they are lovely, I've heard good things about them, but they're almost redundant because the correct needle system is only being made in 2 sizes and costs £1 a needle or more. Retiming to 705 (standard needle) is supposed to be possible, but I haven't heard good things about that approach from OSMGs, my local OSMG mentioned another route he was exploring but I don't know if he was successful.

216g might be worth a look, that has some ZZ and is supposed to be very sturdy pfaffs 130 131 260 and 92 (concrete grey box) might also be good to keep an eye open for Crestas (sometimes called lada maybe 132 (like in my signature) they have a reputation for being a solid stitcher and are somewhat sought after.

Or the 15 with a zz attachment they are very tough and easily sourced, but more limited on the stitches.

Hope that helps
A bit of a vintage sewing machine nut! Singers: 500a, 401g, 48k Elnas: lotus SP & grasshopper, Bernina 530-2 F+R 504, Pfaff 30, Cresta T-132