The Sewing Place

Machine Talk => Vintage Machines => Topic started by: Acorn on June 28, 2019, 17:08:25 PM

Title: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Acorn on June 28, 2019, 17:08:25 PM
I have just spotted this lovely thing in a shop not too far away.

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The needle and bobbin move beautifully when the wheel is turned, and the treadle turns the wheel underneath the cabinet smoothly and freely, but the treadle belt is missing.  It seems to me (who knows next to nothing about these things) that this link should be quite straightforward...?

The decals are very good, but looking at Fiddlebase (https://www.fiddlebase.com/british-machines/jones-co/jones-family-cs-machines/) the dacals suggest 1896, but the fact that it's a treadle machine suggests 1901.  The serial number on the machine is 577, but I can't find any info about that - the serial numbers listed in various places seem to come from the manuals not the machines.

I didn't check that there was a bobbin in the shuttle case - presumably that's not likely to be too difficult to get?  There is also a piece of rubber broken off from the thingy that goes against the wheel to wind the bobbin (the piece is there, but very hard, and not very grippy against the wheel)  - again, would that be hard to replace?

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Does anyone have any advice?  I'm sorely tempted, but don't want to end up with a machine that doesn't work.  The question of where on earth I would put it is also a salient one... and may prove to make it impossible anyway.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: wrenkins on June 28, 2019, 17:20:51 PM
Buy it this minute.
It looks to me like the Singer 27k (Low bobbin winder) and if the parts are transferable then it's the easiest thing to fit them.
I bought stuff from these people (https://www.singersewinginfo.co.uk/). My contact was Judith Bailey and she was very helpful. She'll probably know if the singer bits and pieces will fit the Jones.
It's veh beautiful.  :loveit:
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Radiofan on June 28, 2019, 17:38:52 PM
Looks like a Jones branded Singer 27k -beautiful decals. The treadle belt, bobbins and bobbin winding rubber can still be purchased new, but even with the Singers, there are 3 types of bullet shuttle, so it is best to make sure the original is present.

If you don't already own a machine from this era, it's well worth buying, especially with treadle.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Surest1tch on June 28, 2019, 17:49:01 PM
Grab it fast , I'm sure if any things missing one of us will be able to find it for you, and if there is anything missing...... haggle the price down 👍
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Acorn on June 28, 2019, 18:05:11 PM
The price is £140 - does that seem reasonable?  (It does to me, but I'm frequently astonished at how little beautiful machines go for!)
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: BrendaP on June 28, 2019, 19:40:10 PM
Helen Howes (http://www.helenhowes-sewingmachines.co.uk/shuttles.html) for shuttles and the long bobbins

She also has a page about replacing a treadle belt.
http://www.helenhowes-sewingmachines.co.uk/tutorials/treadlefettle.html (http://www.helenhowes-sewingmachines.co.uk/tutorials/treadlefettle.html)

The other source for vintage parts is Sewlincs (https://www.sewlincs.co.uk/), but as he's an ex-Singer mechanic I'm not sure how much non-Singer stuff he has.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: maliw on June 28, 2019, 19:53:53 PM
I learned to sew on a Jones treadle, oh the memories.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Radiofan on June 28, 2019, 21:25:08 PM
The price is £140 - does that seem reasonable?  (It does to me, but I'm frequently astonished at how little beautiful machines go for!)
Seems a bit high. A mint 28k can be had for £40- 80. I've seen 27ks in treadle table go for about the same. This Jones may look good but the chrome plating is gone from most of the shiny bits and the table has scratches.
I'd offer £80 for it.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: wrenkins on June 29, 2019, 11:08:20 AM
I would tuck it under my arm and RAQ (run away quick). If you want to you can replace all the shiny bits.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Roger on June 29, 2019, 21:11:31 PM
do check that you have a bobbin and shuttle, as its unlikely to be a standard bobbin, if it doesnt and it doesnt have any attachments Id probably walk - also check what sort of needles it needs, they could be something niche like a singer 12 class or the one that the 319/320 take that makes those beautiful machines borderline redundant - although there are work arounds :)

Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Acorn on June 29, 2019, 21:26:32 PM
The shuttle is definitely there, but I did't think of checking to see whether there was a bobbin in it.  There is absolutely nothing else with it apart from the wooden cover.

I think a lack of room is probably finishing it off - if the machine went down into the table as a lot do, it would be a piece of furniture and we could find somewhere for it, but this would always have the machine on top.

@Radiofan, the chrome plating isn't bad - there isn't an awful lot of it anyway, and at worst it's a bit dull.  The end plate is very good.  The wheel is black lacquer not chrome.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Roger on June 29, 2019, 21:32:27 PM
the bobbin and shuttle are the key parts it will probably take standard-ish attachments or the griest omni set :) unless its a back clamp (unlikely) but definitely check needles.

The size and it not folding down may be very tricky. *ses me who uses a 401 in a case as a bedside table*  :S
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Elnnina on June 30, 2019, 15:26:23 PM
Ooooh Acorn that looks a little beauty, and it looks like a black metal base  - just what I would like.  The Jones decals seem to be very different to those of Singer.  Perhaps I cannot see it properly but is there a foot in place?, it looks as though it is just the needle mechanism going down to connect with the bobbin.

If you really want this you have nothing to lose by offering less than the asking price and go from there.  If as you say there is nothing else in there - have you tilted the top up to see if there is anything underneath the machine? - then there is your bargaining point.

I haven't done anything yet to my little vintage Jones hand crank, but that too has flowers on it and the needle is completely round at the top and mine is circa 1925.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Lilian on June 30, 2019, 16:25:59 PM
I have some needles with a completely round shank @Elnnina and wondered where they came from. I have no use for them as all my machines have the flat back shank. Now I know  :)
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Elnnina on June 30, 2019, 18:31:46 PM
Lilian, would you like to sell me your round shank needles?  I have measured the one I have and that is 11/2" long (one and a half inches long).

My mother used to boast that she had never ever changed a needle in her old Frister Rossman (1936) machine and had sewn everything from dainty muslin for bridesmaids dresses, shirring, upholstery - covers for their chairs, curtains and yes canvas awning.  Sadly the tension was rather temperamental and I was never allowed to even change the stitch length - this machine could probably have done with a jolly good service but she was never going to do that.  In fact I inherited  a much newer Bernina (1975) 830 Record and again this has never been serviced and by now this was 2002, so after I had sewn my daughter's wedding dress I took this Bernina and my own Elna to be serviced and it cost me a fortune.  I knew my Elna's tension was playing up - same age as the Bernina, but gulp over £200 for the two.  Both beautiful machines still in perfect working order and used a lot.

Incidentally I change my needles very regularly and my Mother would have a fit if she saw how many I go through - and I always stitch with either Bernina needles for the Bernina or Schmetz for the Elna.

Let me know about the round shanked needles - thanks.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Lilian on June 30, 2019, 18:42:51 PM
@Elnnina I'll look them out, if I've still got them but knowing me I don't throw stuff away lol :)
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Lilian on September 24, 2020, 20:05:52 PM
Lilian, would you like to sell me your round shank needles?  I have measured the one I have and that is 11/2" long (one and a half inches long).

My mother used to boast that she had never ever changed a needle in her old Frister Rossman (1936) machine and had sewn everything from dainty muslin for bridesmaids dresses, shirring, upholstery - covers for their chairs, curtains and yes canvas awning.  Sadly the tension was rather temperamental and I was never allowed to even change the stitch length - this machine could probably have done with a jolly good service but she was never going to do that.  In fact I inherited  a much newer Bernina (1975) 830 Record and again this has never been serviced and by now this was 2002, so after I had sewn my daughter's wedding dress I took this Bernina and my own Elna to be serviced and it cost me a fortune.  I knew my Elna's tension was playing up - same age as the Bernina, but gulp over £200 for the two.  Both beautiful machines still in perfect working order and used a lot.

Incidentally I change my needles very regularly and my Mother would have a fit if she saw how many I go through - and I always stitch with either Bernina needles for the Bernina or Schmetz for the Elna.

Let me know about the round shanked needles - thanks.

Thought I had chucked the round shank needles out, but going through some stuff the other day Eureka!  Are you still interested in them? they are PRYM287/690 and sizes 80/12, 90/14 and 100/16  :)

Just cover postage cost
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Acorn on September 24, 2020, 21:39:29 PM
I've just been re-reading this thread trying to work out why on earth I didn't go and rescue the lovely thing.  Then I got to @Roger's post and remembered that it didn't fold down into the table.  And I also read that Roger has a machine in a cabinet as a bedside table and had that eureka moment that might enable me to buy the next gorgeous one I find - as long as it folds down into the base, of course!   0_0
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Elnnina on September 25, 2020, 10:32:07 AM
Lilian I have only just c aught up on yesterday's post by you regarding the round headed needles.  The answer is yes please and I have PM you. Thank you so much.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Lilian on September 25, 2020, 10:50:19 AM
Lilian I have only just c aught up on yesterday's post by you regarding the round headed needles.  The answer is yes please and I have PM you. Thank you so much.

Not received a PM yet @elnina - I only have one pack of 5 needles  :)
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Lilian on September 25, 2020, 10:54:17 AM
@Elnnina Just received your PM  ;) must be my internet slowing down :)
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Elnnina on September 26, 2020, 11:05:31 AM
Thank you so much Lilian the needles have arrived safely.
Title: Re: Jones Treadle Machine
Post by: Lilian on September 26, 2020, 20:05:59 PM
Sorry I didn't get back to you yet @Elnnina I have been busy assembling my mannequin as it fell apart  :o  I bought it second hand really cheap so can't grumble.  I have finished my plaids/tartan dress and wanted to photograph it. but when I picked it up it didn't like it  :S.  Glue gun is put away now so can get photos tomorrow.


Glad the needles arrived safely and swiftly! lol

Will pm you later  ;)