The Sewing Place
The Emporia => Sewing Professionally => Topic started by: Bloobell on February 22, 2018, 12:20:08 PM
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I'm lucky in that this doesn't happen all that often, but today appears to be my lucky day (again). My 11am booking didn't turn up. They only booked the appointment on Tuesday so I didn't send a reminder.
I hate it when this happens. I have to tidy my darn workroom in order to make it look semi-presentable, and pack away the bridal dress I was working on about 20 mins before the appointment, to give me time to hoover quickly.
Then I have to sit and wait on them, just in case they were delayed in traffic. Thirty minutes after the appointment time, I finally give in, and get back on with my day. That's an hour I lose, each and every time someone just hasn't the manners to let me know they've changed their mind and aren't coming.
Where are people's manners nowadays? They'd be charged by a dentist now for being late, or non-attendance, so maybe I need to do the same.
I had an email address for this person, and have emailed them to say they've missed their appointment and I regret that I no longer feel it's possible for me to fit them into my busy schedule.
Does this happen to us all? How does everyone else deal with it?
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Well done for that email bloobell! That's just plain rude! Not to mention the cost to your working day...
Hope it really inconveniences them!
Jessie
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If they try and make another appointment - I doubt it - just tell them to find somebody else.
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You could maybe charge for the first appointment (and payment before the date too) which then gets taken off the bill at the end?
My husband teaches privately and he always asks for payment as soon as the date is booked. On the odd occasion he's agreed to being paid a few days before or on the day he has always been let down, very frustrating.
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Oh, Bloobell...this drives me round the bend too.
I know exactly what you mean about halting your day to await a customer.
This is my HOME....not a shop you can just arrive at whenever's convenient :angry: ...and I always give them longer than is really necessary, just in case of traffic problems/family crisis etc.
It's terrible...such bad manners.
Sandra.
xxx
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This drives me round the bend as well.
They don't reliase that you have to stop what you are working on .then get it all out again
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I've looked back at my records and pretty much all my no-shows have been someone wanting something made for a kid. This pair wanted a pram accessory. A sun shade, that they could probably buy easily but not in their "specially chosen" fabric. As if the kid cares......
Thank goodness for my excited, giddy, bouncing off the walls brides and bridesmaids.
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Thank goodness for my excited, giddy, bouncing off the walls brides and bridesmaids.
Yes..They arrive in a pack (herd?) and they're chatty and excited talking about make-up, hair and shoes and gossiping about who they're going to 'have' to invite. 0_0
But it always worries me having beautiful gowns hanging around and hoping I can store them safely until they're collected.
Sandra.
xxx
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I'm more relaxed about it than I used to be, mainly because my cats were both much younger when I started the business and a lot more curious about what I was doing! Now, our sole survivor is 17 and only concerned with eating and cuddling and snoozing on our bed. I'll have to think over my security arrangements again when the time comes to add some new furry vandals to our family.
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You did absolutely the right thing unless of course there was a really good plausible excuse, like say a family member being involved in an accident or a bereavement.
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Bloobell, if you don't need the business just turn these time wasters away.
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My husband also runs a business seeing clients from home and like you has to set things up (and settle the cats somewhere out of the way). He also rents rooms a couple of half days a week.
He used to get no shows. Now he asks each new client for their credit card details when they make an appointment. If they make excuses not to give cc details over the phone he suggests they send a cheque or do a bank transfer. Usually at that stage they say they have changed their minds.
He also has a 48 hour cancellation policy.
I asked him yesterday about no-showe. He told me that the last half dozen no shows he had had where people simply did not show up for a first appointment and never offered an explanation had been where he'd made an exception to the credit card rule. Now he doesn't make exceptions.
I should though point out that the charging for no-shows or late cancellations rule isn't always enforced - it depends on the reason and the attitude and previous reliability of the client.
I would do as he does and ask for a non-refundable deposit and explain why. If people are committed to getting the work done and are themselves reliable and sensible they will understand.
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Bloobell, if you don't need the business just turn these time wasters away.
You can't always tell who the time wasters are though! Andy had a conversation with a potential customer and afterwards said to me "I don't think we'll get anything from her". 4 years later and she has done many many courses with him, probably one of his top spending customers and her and her husband are now friends.
@Goth Gardiner yep whenever you make an exception they always let you down.
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By 'timewasters', I was really thinking of what Bloobell said earlier:
I've looked back at my records and pretty much all my no-shows have been someone wanting something made for a kid. This pair wanted a pram accessory. A sun shade, that they could probably buy easily but not in their "specially chosen" fabric. As if the kid cares......
If it's not part of my core business, I wouldn't even entertain it.
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Sometimes the most plausible people are those who just don't turn up. I've had brides, bridesmaids etc do a disappearing act, too.
I had one bridesmaid who was in desperate need of help. The wedding was only two weeks away, she was maid of honour, and she was pregnant (but hadn't been, when they bought the dress). She was about 6 months along, and getting bigger by the day, and her dress could not be fastened, at all. She begged me to squeeze her in (in all ways) so I found room in my diary that day.
Guess who never showed up? I even texted her to check she was okay, as it was only three hours since I'd spoken to...she ignored me.
She was called all kind of rude and totally unprintable names by me, as I'd had to ask another client to move her appointment around, purely so I could fit this woman in when it suited HER (she had kids she needed to pick up from school).
I no longer bend over backwards for anyone, and I certainly would never ask another client to change their booking again.
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Sigh.....
Another no show. She contacted me on Friday asking about a dress being made for her for June 2nd. Now that's a tight ask as it is, but I thought, well we might as well have a chat about what she's looking for. Made the appointment for this morning, so there I go, putting away my 6 foot long folding table, the pattern I was working on, organising my other client's garments to cover them properly etc (I ask for no touching but you cannot guarantee they'll keep their hands off even then..) and vacuuming and tidying myself up. Ready to go, 15 mins before the appointment.
And nothing.
Not a call, not a text, not an email.
I have to sit and wait for 30 mins beyond the appointment just in case it's a "late" scenario rather than a no show, but eventually it's give up and put my workroom back to a functioning space again.
Ignorant, mannerless *&$%£
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
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Bloobell, how bl***y rude! Can you take a deposit when they make an appointment which would be non-refundable in the event of a no-show. Obviously if the appointment is kept, the account could be creditted.
So sorry you've had such a waste of time.
Jessie
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I've considered a deposit but I'm not sure how to implement it. I guess I could take a credit card number like a previous poster but it gets so complex and I'm not sure how you could do it legally. You'd almost need to have a contract or something, saying they agree that the deposit is non refundable in case of missed appointments etc. What if they didn't turn up, yet argued you had no right to keep "their" money...you'd need to have something in writing surely to protect yourself as a business. I'm not sure if it's worth doing if I'm going to have people bad mouthing my business and shouting online about how horrible I am etc, threatening legal action and all the associated "mob behaviour".
I'm just so disappointed that there are so many ignorant pigs in the world who have no manners and no care of the consequences to a business for them deciding they'd rather go for a coffee with a pal rather than keep an appointment that THEY asked for.
I have a dim enough view of human nature as it is.....which may be why I find it harder to shake these incidents off and get on with my day. I hate the attitude some people have. I just have to remind myself that these are the minority. Although unreasonable requests are becoming more frequent.
I had someone phone me on Sunday afternoon, when we were busy car hunting, needing a skirt made smaller for them by Monday morning.
Yeah, right.
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Although I agree it's not ideal but you could take a deposit via paypal? Fairly straight forward to refund if they turn up.
You could take a mobile number and text them a coupe of hours before saying 'don't forget your appointment if you can't make it please let me know'?
I take it you don't have another space you can use for initial consultations so you don't have to pack up your work?
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Most people / places now take a mobile number and text a couple of hours before the client is due.... just a thought :)
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It is a difficult one this, and, like other professions that you have to book appointments with, we just have to accept that we are going to get no shows, no matter what you do. I have sent text messages, left voice messages and still they do not arrive. Ring to find out were they are "decided to go home for some tea first, i will come round in an hour". No you b***** well wont.
I did try offering home visits but that was fraught with problems as well. You turn up to collect a couple of pairs of trousers that want altering to find she has got every item of clothing out of the wardrobe for your opinion and 2 hours later she is still trying them on and you end up with a pile of alterations you could do without.
Worse for me is the customer who turns up unanounced, at all hours (even 9pm) and expect you to "just take my dress up an inch, I'll wait". No matter what i do or say it is water of a ducks back, she will always be the same.
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Yep, got to agree, no shows are so frustrating! I used to be in the same situation of having to tidy up etc, before an appointment, but I've since moved my sewing room upstairs and see appointments downstairs in the living room, which doesn't get much other use. I have dressing screen in there too, for the more modest customers, and a full length mirror.
Just as annoying are the ones that turn up late, without thinking how it impacts on the rest of the day. They invariably do it on a busy day and coincide with the next appointment. Or, when you make an evening appointment and are waiting to have your meal afterwards and they either don't come or arrive late. Drives DH mad cos he does the cooking and never knows what time to aim for.
I find it's usually the ones that make an appointment via my Facebook page that don't show up, or arrive late, but luckily not many of them. The ones that actually phone usually turn up.
I do usually send a text or message asking if they've forgotten their appointment, if they don't show up, but there is always the odd one you're glad hasn't turned up. They don't get a message!
Texts and Facebook messages at all times of the day and night and weekends are also a bugbear, especially as I never remember to silence my phone. An early morning text is very annoying when you're asleep!
I keep home visits to an absolute minimum, as it takes too much valuable work time up. But I do have one exception, a lady I've visited for many years. She has problems parting with any clothes that aren't totally worn out, and further problems with not being able to resist a bargain. Hence, she always has stacks of skirts and dresses awaiting some attention (quite often letting out waistbands over the years). I usually end up spending about 3 hours with her while she tries them all on and I pin them. It takes so long because she likes to chat and can't seem to dress and talk at the same time. Luckily I've been blessed with a lot of patience and look on these afternoons with her more as a social call (don't get a cuppa though). Since her health and mobility have deteriorated I've even ended up putting her clothes away for her, in her wardrobes. Above and beyond the call of duty, but can't have her falling over trying to do it herself.
Hoping next week's visit to her isn't too time consuming.
Suzie :vintage:
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I wouldn't mind betting that you're a bright spot in her life, Suzie. <3
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Ah Suzie, I bet your time together is something she really treasures. I have a few clients I visit at their homes too, due to disabilities and/or age and not driving. I write off an entire afternoon when I'm booked to see them, as they tend to enjoy a wee chat. I don't mind, as I plan for it and have worked with them many times so am quite fond of them. I was absolutely devastated when one of my lovely "oldies" died a few years ago. She was really good fun.
Re using another room.....I wish. I really wish I had another spare room I could use just to see clients, but I don't, so access is limited to just my workroom. I do see one client in my living room, as she's disabled and can't manage the stairs. She wants to come out to see me as she loves her wee trip out, plus she lives an hour away, so she and her hubby make a day of it, and go for lunch somewhere. For me to go to her, it would be at least a three, if not four, hour round trip. It's not perfect but she's a lovely person and she's one of my regulars, so I make an exception for her. I've no intention of making a habit of it. It's my family living room after all. I'd have to spend just as long tidying that as I do my workroom lol!!!!
I think I'm just going to have to accept that some people have absolutely no manners, no consideration and no intention of changing. All I can do is update their name in my phone's contacts to the word "Timewaster!" so I know if they call again that they've got previous.
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Well, yesterday's trip to see my elderly (well she's a bit older than me ;)) lady was a record breaker! Despite telling her I was pushed for time and hoped she didn't have a lot of work for me, she managed to spin it out to 3 1/2 hours! She had me dragging out and putting away dresses from years ago, to see if they either still fitted or could be made longer. So, I've come away with another stack to try and reincarnate!!
Next time I'll say I can stay as long as she likes, and maybe I'll get away quicker 0_0. Ended up working till 11.45pm to recover the lost afternoon.
Bless her!
Suzie :vintage:
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My daughter is a dog groomer and I am amazed by the number on ‘no shows’ she has every week. It is so easy to get in touch nowadays- txt, email etc, but they just don’t think. Obviously everyone can forget things, but she does do text reminders. Usually they phone up a couple of days later hoping for an appointment at short notice!
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Would it not be possible to take a consultation fee for a first visit? And if they go ahead with an order, then say you will deduct the fee from the total cost? That way if they don't turn up you will have this fee to pay for your time?
The consultation fee would have to be paid for at the time of making the appointment too, so you safely have the money before they visit? I wonder how many people would be filtered out at the making the appointment stage? And I bet they would be your time wasters too?
Would get rid of the problem with asking for deposits etc?
Just an idea.
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I'm torn.
On the one hand, I genuinely think the fee idea is a great one.
On the other, I can see so many problems with it.
Can you imagine how much damage one or two cheesed off mouthy gits using social media could do to my business, if they "forgot" their appointment and I "refused to refund them"? Seriously? Look at the mob culture we're dealing with right now.
My friend, Susie, is a wedding photographer. She drives a car with her business name on it. She was approaching a junction, had right of way, but had to slam on her brakes to avoid a female driver who pulled out of the junction without warning. My friend, Susie, beeped her horn and probably shouted a few sweary words, but nothing out of the ordinary - basically just a normal response to someone trying to kill you. Later that day, her business facebook page was flooded, inundated, and absolutely bombarded by hideous reviews, horrible comments, insulting memes, offensive pictures...you name it, she received it. The other driver had written a post on Susie's page, using really offensive language and had then decided to get all her friends involved and almost successfully destroyed her entire business. Facebook got involved, and even the police ended up being involved.
It's an extreme example, I know, but do I really want to risk the mob descending on me and destroying 14 years of my hard work?
I love the idea of a fee, but honestly, I don't think I have the nerve to do it.
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Social media can certainly be vicious and I can't understand what makes people say the vilest things online to someone they have never met. Some of these same people would probably have torched her shop as punishment for a non-existent harm.
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Social media can certainly be vicious and I can't understand what makes people say the vilest things online to someone they have never met. Some of these same people would probably have torched her shop as punishment for a non-existent harm.
They basically did. They torched her online presence. All because one of them was ticked off for driving like a lunatic.
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That's bad enough, but I was thinking of a bricks and mortar shop full of expensive stock. Imagine if it was a bridal boutique or fabric shop. :o
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It is a fine line, really.
My business plan reads like this for custom work:
1. All first time clients for custom work must make appointments in person during normal business hours and will pay a $25 non-refundable fee where they receive a pamphlet describing what to expect, what to bring, rush fees, etc. The fee is applied to work, or kept as a consultation/cancellation fee if no show or no work. They sign a fee acknowledgement when making the appointment that outlines all of this.
2. Return customers do not need to make appointments in person, but will be subject to missed appointment fees if no notice is given, added to the final bill.
3. Missed appointments without notice is subject to refusal of work; present and future.
For alterations:
I don't charge for appointments, because I don't really require an appointment. If a garment needs special work (basically not needed hemmed) or multiple garments, I recommend one and may schedule one when the items are dropped off. I also have /days hours specifically for alteration needs, appointments are necessary for times outside of those posted and subject to custom work policies.
For stylist services:
1. Appointments must be made in person and the non-refundable appointment fee of $50 is required at the time of the booking. Another fee acknowledgement is signed at that time, and another list of items to bring/research/pamphlet is given at that time.
2. Returning customers must follow styling policies, no exceptions.
3. The fee will cover the initial 30 minute appointment and the following hour consult. A fee schedule is available for further services is available for additional work. (And I charge by the hour for what I do, but I'll go to their home, shopping, etc.)
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Interesting. I don't do the styling stuff, but I can see that you'd definitely want your time paying for with that. Otherwise, it'd be a free service as you're not making what they buy!
I think this would work superbly if I had premises separate from my home, and was only there during "normal hours", but I don't.
I really do not want people turning up in person, knocking on my door at all hours, to book appointments or worse, "I'll just pop in and get it done right now". I get that already with some villagers, but most folks phone me and ask first.
I need to rent a shop, don't I? With fixed opening hours and an answering machine. It's a pity I can't afford it.
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How about a business phone which you switch off/recorded message only outside of "normal working hours" and keep your main phone for friends/family/domestic use.
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Styling is a service different then sewing. I have different packages, this particular one is basically just a styling overview. Colors, body shape, hair styles...and figuring out what your style is already and what you want to look like and marrying that together to make you look your best. I also have personal shopping, going to your home and packages that include tailoring...and the cost goes up from that initial fee. It's not exactly just a "Oh hey you're a pear, and you need a fit and flare dress." It's more like, "Here's your measurements, and we can see that you have such a tiny waist in the numbers. Looking at the pictures we took, you can see where when we accent it, it draws attention to how lovely your figure is, but it needs to be balanced to bring out how tiny that waist really is." with examples of clothes that fit into their style already, just updated and more chic then perhaps they are wearing right now.
And I point out that most higher end department stores offer personal shopping and alterations done on site if needed. I also have done it for personal styling boxes to help them figure out why something works or doesn't work and help them make those choices have a better box.
It's just a different skill set then sewing, but kind of goes in with the alteration/design side.
As to doing it from your home, yes I understand not wanting people to just show up and appointments are necessary for that. You can also set aside a corner of your room for fitting, or have a screen to block off the cutting/sewing area...or just have the appointment in a different room all together. If they don't make the appointment then it's no great loss in your time, which was kind of my awkward way of pointing it out before.
There are also programs that you can get that email/text/call reminders for appointments and you can make a reply necessary to keep it. While they do cost, you can also schedule part of your time to do it yourself. When I did my apprenticeship, I found that it didn't matter which option was used by the tailor I worked for...paying someone else to do it or the company...but a text worked the best. I would go via pay, but only because I'd get the reply to confirm appointment and I hate my phone (doesn't matter if it's text or voice, lol). My drawback to it is that I use an actual agenda/diary for appointments and I'd have to put them into an online calendar to make it work.
But I did bring this up with a friend of mine who does appointment only special occasion work (she is no longer working from home, but did when she started). We have different business models to begin with, and she said that on her website she mentioned the cancellation fee on the FAQ, appointment page and booking page and paid for booking software where she grabs the credit card information. There is a check box you have to accept that shows you read her policy ($50 for no show or cancel less then 3 days, the amount of time the appointment is and the fact that if you're late for it she won't be able to accommodate the time overage). Her confirmation email also states store policies (like only 3 additional people allowed in for the appointment) and a time line of how long to expect the whole process to take and that there's at least 3 more appointments plus a way to cancel the appointment as well as her contact information. The fee is applied to an order you make within 60 days of the missed appointment, with some restrictions, so it's basically an incentive to make it there on time.
And you do get an idea of who will no show and who won't when you're working. Stuff like this weeds them out better.
I think there's several ways you can go about reducing no shows, regardless of if you have a stand alone shop, work from home, have appointment only based work...or a myriad of other options out there.
Not that my opinion amounts to much, haha, but I'd leave most of it automated and pay for someone to do a website, booking program and SMS reminders. And if I charged for missed appointments, I would go this way certainly, even though I live in a really small, rural town. Kind of goes to the old thing of spend money to make money. I also take myself way too seriously, lol. It's not just sewing, it's not just an alteration, it is a lifestyle, baby. I take the vapidness of fashion to a whole new level of insane.
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I take the vapidness of fashion to a whole new level of insane.
:loveit: :* :loveit: :* :loveit:
What a marvelous line! I'm borrowing stealing it.
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I'll look into an automated service, Kwaaked, thank you for suggesting it. I didn't know such things existed. I do text my clients about their appointments, to remind them, but some still just ignore me. I like the idea of online booking, with an automatic fee for non-appearances built in along with the terms and conditions etc. Brilliant. I'll look into that, thanks!
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I also run an appointment based business. Yes, we get no shows relatively often. Usually these are the folk who will not need to pay, and therefore do not value the service. They think' It is free to me, therefore if I fail to turn up, no-one loses'.
WRONG!
that is an appointment I could have given to someone else, and if they do not show up it costs me a significant sum.
Even more frustrating, I am not permitted to charge a deposit for some of these, 'in case it stops them coming'.
(NHS...)