The Sewing Place
Machine Talk => Sewing Machines => Topic started by: Lulu on March 26, 2018, 19:36:59 PM
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The title says it all really..
I've been researching madly away and have kind of settled on this machine, as I'm looking for a good all-rounder that's future proof and as easy to use as possible.
That said I've never properly sewn before, so have no idea what I'm looking at!
I'm hoping to make clothes for my LO and myself, but don't want to rule out other project ideas either. I'm keen to try the freehand embroidery for adding some applique touches. Oh, and we're big denim lovers, so our machine must be able to cope with that!
Is this a good choice?
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I’ve never had a Janome sewing machine.. always had Pfaff so no idea really but lots of folks swear by Janome. The only thing I would say is you need a zig zag, a good buttonhole and a few utility stitches. There’s no need for dozens and dozens of fancy ones. Some would say a good second hand vintage one is just as good if not better.
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My DD has the DXL603, think it's the next model up. She did textiles at A- level and really uses the machine at its limits -sews everything from denim to silk to newspaper :S The machine has coped with everything so far and has been totally reliable so I say go for it. I've had Janome machine for the last 30 odd years and it's yet to let me down.
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I think my sister has this one (it's definitely a Janome :D) and is happy with it, seems to sew most things.
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A zigzag is a good choice for a versatile machine. I don't know this one offhand but I'm often shocked when I hear of budget models that don't give you the freedom to select the stitch length & width for all the stitches. :angry:
Perhaps the sales pitch is it keeps the newbie in the right ballpark & removes the pressure of them having to select these every time themselves. That's just plain wrong on several levels.
Personally I'd say basics are:
* free stitch length & width control,
* feed dogs that can be moved up & down by the user,
* some good utility stitches,
* at least one decent buttonhole & not pre-set sizes (not necessarily 1-step either, the very best ones I have are 4-step & it's not rocket science),
* it doesn't creak & flex when you lift by the handle or elsewhere,
then it's worthy of consideration.
Desirables are:
* adjustable foot pressure (weight of the foot holding the fabric down)
* adjustable speed control (some have a switch on the foot pedal, some it's on the machine).
There are lots of other things that are nice to have but all the things above will have an impact on the quality of your sewn items as a newbie and onwards. :D
Have fun, we'll enjoy following how you go too. And help you if/when you need it of course.
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I've had a Janome XL601 for the past 4 years, started as a beginner. It's coped with everything I've thrown at it so far (quilting, bag making, denim, liberty lawn, furnishing fabric with piping). I've still to try free motion and I've only done a little bit of jersey fabrics. I've certainly not outgrown it.
I suggest getting the walking foot, mine came as a special offer with other bits too.
Go have a test drive if you can. That's what I did and decided I like the convenience of electronic and this was the top of my budget.
I need to go slow some of the times with thick seams but I suspect that's pretty common for most machines in the same price bracket.
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Thank you all for your responses Efemera, Kad, Samantha, Marnie and Bogwoppit. This is certainly a very friendly and active forum, to get all these answers so quickly! And it sounds as though generally speaking I've not made a bad choice.
I've read lots of praise for the vintage machines Efemera, and it's certainly an attractive thought buying something that would last a lifetime! But the downside of these is probably the heavy weight? As I am hoping to take the machine to a class or two!
I've read the spec again Marnie, and I think it ticks most of your boxes - although it does have a one step button hole and I'm not sure if the sizes are pre-set for these (it says it comes with 3 'styles'?) I can send my local store a message to ask though, and I will check out the creaking/flexing when we visit, hopefully this weekend!
Ah Bogwoppit, great to hear from an owner and thanks for the tip regarding the foot! I will ask if we can test drive this weekend. But it's fab to hear that you still have not needed to upgrade your machine.
Really looking forward to getting to know everybody and their projects over the coming months, and just can't wait to get started now
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Marnie makes some good points and I've just googled your choice which will be a good starter machine.
The thing that was essential for me when I bought my first machine (a Janome 525Sewist) was an auto needle threader as I'm gradually getting blinder and blinder as the age thing kicks in.... which I see this model has.
Looking at it I think you will be very happy with it the only thing I can't see is whether it has the adjustable foot pressure and whether the front of the machine (over the needle) can be opened.
My second Janome (4000) did not have either of these and I was pretty miffed as my cheaper first machine did and this one was twice the price!
Whether you find this machine fulfills all your needs for many years or want to upgrade after a while you will find Janomes keep their value well and you will easily be able to sell them on.
Enjoy, we look forward to reading about your progress and of course seeing pics of your makes!
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You can change the foot pressure, although the dial is hidden and doesn't have any markings. I used permanent marker so I knew where it was to start with before I fiddled with it.
Buttonholes can be done one step with the buttonhole foot or bit by bit manually.
I think you can download the manual from the janome site.
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@Lulu
although it does have a one step button hole and I'm not sure if the sizes are pre-set for these (it says it comes with 3 'styles'?
Your machine will come with one of these....
(https://www.gursewingmachines.com/images/products/janome-buttonhole-foot-j-830823004_1_medium.jpg)
It opens up and you put your button of choice in the gap at the back which tells 'the machine' how big to sew the buttonhole.
Sorry but Im not very eloquent today but it is pretty obvious how it works, although I find opening the thing up to be quite difficult
janome buttonhole tut (https://youtu.be/0YzWk006hv8)
I find that if you have the speed limiter on a slow speed, detach the foot pedal and sew using the start button, ie you aren't doing anything with your hands or feet, the machine is sewing on its own ... they make very nice and neat buttonholes
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@Iminei do you really find that slowing things down and using the stop/start button really makes a difference?
Must admit that it's something I'd never thought to try.
@Lulu I love my Janomes, at the moment I have 3. I admire your thinking of buying the best you can afford rather that getting one of the cheap lightweight £99 jobbies that lots of places sell these days. You are looking at a machine that will last for a long time, not something that, should you enjoy sewing, you will grow out of in six months.
There is so much knowledge here that there are very few problems you won't find an answer to, we all learn from one another.
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... it does have a one step button hole and I'm not sure if the sizes are pre-set for these (it says it comes with 3 'styles'?) I can send my local store a message to ask though,
I've struggled to access their brochure (can't seem to download a free manual) but have now upgraded Adobe Flash & it works! This model has more features than I'd expect from many others in this price bracket. Janome do have a reputation for being high featured for the price so that's always attractive. The brochure shows it has adjustable foot pressure (especially good for sewing knits) and a slider to adjust the speed (very newbie-friendly that :D ) so it looks like you've got all the bases covered. :)
The needle up/down and knee lift, whilst not essential are particularly nice to have so I think you'll really enjoy your experience with it. You may not even guess the thing you'll find you never want to be without again as, like Imi's needle threader, it may be on some people's 'nice to have' list but definitely on the 'must have' list for lots of others.
My comment about buttonholes is only because 1-step are often quoted as a very desirable feature but it's really only convenience and the best ones on my machines are the 4-step so I'd never reject a machine that didn't have 1-step. What's more, Imi has personal experience of this one so that's reassuring too.
Have fun! :D
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Certainly slowing right down is an amazing feature and I can achieve incredible detail going slow ....
this street scene of Blandford Forum is 9" x 4.5" and the pub sign, The Dolphin, is 3/8" x 6/8" and the sign is machine stitched, literally one tiny stitch at a time.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/h9FCnTClnKRFxc1X60SA41kD2d-aN94VlBHMbyjmcbC8ufhKpGmvJ_zK8g4BTKZi0kr7S0kaKLLoyMF_qGUBaVV3VSbiM1Qgr2Cbq2mDs0J6XYXFbuscTLlbEQsi-nQ3q9ZS6JdnVnUdkuKiJdin3lyWp6Mqfd-nUPGBcvLlcwp7QaHjYkoVb4u04bkHb6BTYUCiRRotSqceTFKIyEtR25hLLGLSHgQ_HAVUxAH09zsTtBYLz3qSDc0Mdhbta-EFJLQjYiIpfRh3IHlZ4Ux_tv2T3ImLaEvW4v5Sy-sKMmYBkt53hOrFjy-r1U1p_X5xx90OXsFBjVzAPpgyXElcQ2Jb1k2NL0G8kZkR-BJK5DupwbLDvxB8FwMEtZkVMCx7_pxusQtjR_BPKS7xoJrl5ShklPit3ppNfBBSh_P807aKWBS8ykzLixRhT-lA8Xt-hS4fL1Urj8HK4DPultSA1kWHw8DjcAAV5jGQRMBsROGv3prG7FomoVSc6YbIYYLZiGynnW3OMWki6YWO0dMClIPlg43thyhnCNKwzvllFMWNHkOYIqUcksidjn6vizFKgle53R3r7tkhhas-gC_AuCCRn8-kgW02xe1rPA9gchNb3-UVOPmtl9V0gSx8HLQivIXxg03qIdSWDdUV5KSuOhp0YRY=w1149-h585-no)
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Oh my gosh, @Iminei your street scene is stunning. How amazing to be able to sew art!
@Ellabella I do like to research before investing in a new gadget. It normally means that I end up spending more than I should for a load of features I probably don't need :D But I'd rather do that, than buy something cheap which won't last.
Well, after everyone's words of encouragement, I was feeling very positive about buying XL601..so I went online to compare prices and then was offered a couple of deals by the British Sewing Centre for the next model up DXL603 (60 stitches) and one I hadn't even looked at, the TXL607 (400 stitches & top of the XL range).
I called our local sewing shop to compare prices, and the specialist there has called into question whether any of the Janome models mentioned above will be suitable, as they are so lightweight. He says they would struggle with several layers of denim as needed for the seams on jeans etc. He has suggested the cheaper CXL301, which is a heavier version of the 601, but missing a few accessories. (Hmm, I was beginning to fancy some extra decorative stitches).
Now I'm now getting rather tired and confused with it all :S Going to the shop again today to hear their recommendations and actually try the machines.
@Bogwoppit how does your machine handle double denim seams? (sorry, don't know the correct terminology!)
Thank you all again, and apologies, as this must be getting quite boring to hear about now!
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It's ok for me as I don't do too many and take it slow. It's better with walking foot but if you are going to do a lot you might find it a bit tough. Sometimes I think it might be better of the foot lifted a little higher.
Maybe you could take some ready prepared test pieces to practice with on? Then you'll get to see the difference between the machines.
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If you ae going to test drive any machine it's a good idea to take your own bits of fabric - what they are likely to have for you to try sewing is something like craft weight cotton (P&Q fabric) which is about as good natured as fabric gets.
The leg from an old pair of jeans would do just fine to see how it copes going over doubled fell seams (3 + 3 layers of denim) but also take something quite flimsy to try it in the other extreme.
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@Lulu The British Sewing Centre is ringing alarm bells with me. The address (Delta Court) is the same as was used by Cooper Sewing Machines which featured on Rogue Traders and/or Watchdog.
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For test stitching I would bring a densely woven cotton duck or heavier canvas. Regular denim jeans isn't difficult to stitch through at all, the challenge is where pices with flat felled seams come together, and the lay up on legs where you have then folded twice (three layers of flat felled seams add up to quite a bump). Corduroy is a fabric some machines struggle with. One popular janome model haluted in a fabric with a fusable inner lining, something that in theory isn't very hard to stitch through. It all depens on what you will end up working with. Some machine are totally incapable with top stitch thread regardless of needle size, others adjust very easily for various thread weights. This is one of the reasons my cast iron 201 is still my favorite machine.
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@Lulu The British Sewing Centre is ringing alarm bells with me. The address (Delta Court) is the same as was used by Cooper Sewing Machines which featured on Rogue Traders and/or Watchdog.
I think you are right StitchinTime, it rang bells with me too last night. I was going to post about it this morning.
The company trading as 'The British Sewing Centre' is shown as FLC Distributors Ltd (this is the Company name shown under the terms and conditions on the British Swing Centre site). And if you look on Companies House one of the directors is a gentleman called Jay Cooper and further information shows that FLC Distributors Ltd 'used to be known as 'Coopers Sewing Machines Ltd.
https://www.britishsewingcentre.co.uk/pages/terms-and-conditions
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00975232
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@Lizzy777 Thanks for confirming my suspicions about the British Sewing Centre - Jay Cooper has indeed had his 15 minutes of fame on the TV with regards to his previous company.
@Lulu When testing the machines for heavy weight material, make sure the needle is changed to a 90 or 100 or jeans needle as this will give a much better indication of how the machine can cope than trying it with a standard 80 needle.
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@Bogwoppit Thanks Lisa, you know I think I'll just be doing the odd bit of denim as well.. although I do have a real penchant for denim dungarees on my little boy..maybe a pair for each new size he moves into? 0_0 They are something which consistently we find his legs are too long for from the high street.
@BrendaP
I didn't see your message before we left yesterday, so we haven't trialled a flimsy fabric, but we did bring along with us an old pair of jeans..
I indicated the crossover seam at the bottom of the leg (is that what you call a double felled seam?), but the sales assistant said that no domestic machine would be able to cope with that..? She mentioned a technique she used to finish off those areas, but as the word was not familiar, it has completely gone out of my head.
I presume some kind of hand stitching with a denim needle?
@arrow The assistant did fold the denim over several times to try it, I know she managed to get through at least 3 layers with both of the machines she was talking about. The M50 did not sound as healthy going through as the DKS30, even though one of the selling points of the M range is meant to be their extra power. I hadn't caught your message either before going, so I've not tried the densely woven material.
@StitchinTime You know, she did use the standard needle with the denim...was this part of some ploy then to get me to buy a more expensive machine..?
@StitchinTime @Lizzy777
By the way, you are eagle-eyed angels for picking up on my comment about the British Sewing Centre..we just looked at the Trust Pilot rating and thought they looked good. We'll steer well clear of them then!
Lucky I did resist impulse buying..I decided that I'd prefer to get the machine locally if possible. Too much of the high street disappearing, and it is so much easier to go in and see someone in the event you have issues.
The machine the lady thought most suited my needs was the DKS30, which is very similar in features to the 601 - but more heavy and powerful (& £80ish more expensive). The M50 is the same price (on offer), but has a bunch of extra feet and twenty more stitches, including some pretty embroidery style ones.
I couldn't make my mind up between the two as I wanted the embroidery stitches, but had heard the M50 struggle over several layers of denim. The DKS also had the handy thread cutter button.
So I decided overnight, and this is where you will all really groan..to spend even more and just get the DKS100 (next model up), as this would be the best of both worlds..and anyway, we can pay it off bit by bit on the credit card right? :D
So I contacted our local shop for a deal and they have agreed to throw in the quilting kit for free if we buy that one. And the plan is to pick it up tomorrow.
Just going to duck and hide somewhere now.. while everyone sensible shakes their heads disapprovingly, lol xx
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She tested three layers of denim? It's nothing much at all, any machine should do it. A flat felled seam is four layers and you have it three fold in a few seam bumps. Most good machines can handle the bumps with a bit of tweaking and hand maneuvering. I'm comparing everything to an old Singer 99 and a 201 which might be a bit unfear, but still, these are basic domestic models. My old vintage zigzaggers manage well too. There's plenty of capable new models, they are more pricey though. I'm sure most on this forum have machines that does these jobs with out too much struggle. Perhaps I'm stressing this a bit too much, but it's impossible when what you think of as basic stitching feels like it's too much for the machine and you haven't even reached the seam bump. I want to sew colothes and my machine has to handle coat weight wool, tweed, denim and cotton duck. I sew odd things like plastic, edging leather pieces for bike seats, and card board, some times. I long as it fits under the presser foot I almost expect it to work. I'm so used to the old straight stitchers by now I'm keeping them. I can easily get expensive to push a more delicate machine with plastic gears and weaker parts through the same. Generally it's much lighter work for my 201.
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@Lulu a thread cutter is the one thing I'd love on my machine. Hope you enjoy it!
@arrow that's why I'm keeping my eye out for an old singer - tough work and a decent straight stitch plate and foot. Can't justify the space but if a bargain pops up locally I'll be there.
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@Bogwoppit
I indicated the crossover seam at the bottom of the leg (is that what you call a double felled seam?), but the sales assistant said that no domestic machine would be able to cope with that..? She mentioned a technique she used to finish off those areas, but as the word was not familiar, it has completely gone out of my head.
I presume some kind of hand stitching with a denim needle?
My vintage 201s (top end domestics in their day) will sew through 12 layers of denim.
A felled seam is the type that you often get down the sides of jeans with two rows of stitching. If you happen to be sewing jeans you would need to be able to sew across two layers of those seams which means six layers of denim - indeed it could go to nine layers when hemming the bottom of the legs.
The ability to sew through heavy fabric is the difference between a decent machine and a cheapie.
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My Janomes have all had a black button on the side of the standard foot that enables them to cope with and stitch through bulky seams ...
Vid (https://youtu.be/feYNJ97JmCE)
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@Lulu No groans from me at hearing you went for the next model up - it shows sewing ambition and long term planning :)
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@Lulu I'm sure you won't regret spending the extra money. Buying the best you can afford is so sensible.
There is no way anyone in here is going to groan at the thought of you spending money on sewing equipment. Many of us indulge our habit as much as possible :P.
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Thanks for the vid @Iminei I'll have a look for that black button! Maybe that combined with a denim needle would see me through those hemmed double felled seams?
@arrow @BrendaP
Ahh, it really was the most robust thing in the shop that I could stretch to buy (and over budget if I'm honest at £529).. I do hope that I have bought something decent. I'd be quite mortified otherwise!
@Bogwoppit Yes, I'm already enjoying the thread cutter! :D
@StitchinTime Ha, I certainly have ambition!
I already had 6 patterns printed out and 2 big bags of charity shop clothes ready to cut up..all before I'd even brought my machine home.
@Ellabella
I need to get you all in a room with my husband, so that you can repeat some of these soothing words..sensible, long-term planning etc etc 0_0
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You have bought something decent, no doubt about it. In that price range they tend to be better built, and the differences should be down to the finer points. You have to let us know how it stitches through flat felled seams, handles top stitch thread and notice levels too ;- ) A new machine like this is always very exiting.