The Sewing Place
Machine Talk => Sewing Machines => Topic started by: So Chic on August 23, 2020, 11:38:10 AM
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My neighbour has asked me about these machines as he wants a machine that will sew canvas. I would be grateful for any advice about heavy duty machines not only Singers. Thanks in advance.
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Are you meaning heavy duty vintage machines?
If so, the best is a 201, with 66 coming close behind. The 99s are very similar to the 66 but with a smaller harp space so probably not if he's wanting to sew large pieces of fabric. These are all straight stitchers.
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@Mick has sewn canvas and @Mr Twingo sews leather but I don't know what machines they use.
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@Mick & @Mr Twingo
Help, I would be grateful if you could let me know what machines you use for sewing canvas and/or leather. It might stop my neighbour from making an expensive mistake. Thank you.
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I sew leather by hand. Almost all modern domestic machines will struggle with tough or thicker leathers, even heavy duty ones. They just don't have the torque needed.
As your neighbour is sewing canvas, not leather, then I would say look for a vintage machine. The Singer 201 is a great machine, but I'd be just as happy using a 1970s Jones or Brother.
I've watched oodles of videos about the Singer Heavy Duty machines (the blocky, grey, plastic ones) and opinion is mixed. Personally, I wouldn't buy one; I would go the vintage route.
My most recently purchased 'to keep' machine was the SMD Janome 5018, which is sold as a heavy duty model. It is, as far as I can make out, identical to the Janome Decor Excel 5018, and the HD5000. It has a couple of quirks that drive me mad, like when you use the reverse lever, depending on the position of the needle, the reverse / forward motion does not engage; one more stitch is needed before the direction changes.
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The Singer Heavy Duty machine is rubbish. We had one in the shop. I got to try it and was asked to test it. It certainly doesn’t do what they claim. For this sort of work I’d go for a metal bodied machine. TBH modern Singer machines are all pretty rubbish. There are much better machines around.
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I have been sewing canvas with a Singer Heavy Duty 4423. It's probably twice the weight of good jeans denim, and the machine has no trouble going through two or three layers. It does seem a little fussy about stitch length and tension though. No trouble punching the needle through, but the thread (heavy duty stuff, on the limit of what will slip through the eye of the biggest Jeans needle I can find) will "birds nest" underneath if the settings aren't just right. I don't think it's a problem with the machine as it sews perfectly on lighter fabrics, just some issue with the feed dogs actually moving that much material evenly. Get it right, and it's fine, get it wrong and you're in a world of jammed needles and knotted up thread.
If I did more of this type of work, then perhaps a walking foot would be a good investment?
As Mr Twingo says, the machine itself isn't everyone's cup of tea, but I like it and it does everything I can reasonably ask of a domestic machine, and probably quite a bit more.
Also, bear in mind that "canvas" can be anything from fairly thin fabric that any machine would handle, to heavy sailcloth that would need a massive industrial machine to work with.
Do you know what kind of work your neighbor is actually planning on doing?
I'm reluctant to suggest anything I have not tried myself, but a friend has a Toyota Super Jeans machine, which she says is "like a charging rhino, nothing stops it". About a hundred quid cheaper than the Singer too. Might be worth a look?
As for leather, again it depends very much on the material.
Back in the days when I was making knives, I would wet-form the sheaths from 3mm (1/8") veg tanned hide.
Sewing through three layers of that stuff, again as Mr Twingo says, is best done by hand.
I'd punch each stitch-hole through with an awl, and saddle stitch with two needles, crossing through the holes.
The only machines capable of handling that kind of work were the old-fashioned cobblers ones, and even the vintage machines were way out of my price range.
Nowadays, for lighter, garment-weight split hide, or PU leather, the Singer can plough through with no drama at all.
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https://www.sailrite.com/Sewing-Machines
They make a good heavy duty machine, portable and not.
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Thank you all for such detailed replies and I will pass the information to my neighbour. However, from reading all answers I would go down the vintage route if it were me.
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Another thought has just popped into my brain.
If it's heavier canvas that is to be sewn, your neighbour will also have to consider the weight of the thread. Most domestic machines can't cope with thicker threads, partly because they weren't designed for it, and partly because it's incredibly difficult to find suitable needles. The largest domestic needle I've been able to find is an 18/120 (from memory).
Wouldn't it be great if there were a simple answer to the question?!
Go back to your neighbour and ask:
• What is the thickest canvas he'll sew?
• How many layers?
• How often?
The Sailrite machines are decent, but finding a UK stockist… good luck with that! The portable ones have a walking foot, and use an arrangement of pulleys to increase the torque and slow the speed. Other than that, I know little about them.
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I spoke to my neighbour last night and found that he wants a machine to share with his daughter so that he can sew very heavy canvas and she can make children's clothes. I told him he's unlikely to find a machine that will do both so he's gone off to think about it.
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The Toyota Oekaki is designed to sew heavy denim as well as normal domestic things. I had one for a while - it was faulty, and as it was a one-off bargain I had to take a refund rather than having a replacement. It was a lovely machine though. Solid and well made, and the stitches that worked, worked well.